Brothers of Arms

[Magman]

I like to get the ideas of my fellow guildies about how the skill, profession and crafting should be in AoC
The game Director has announce a Major update of this system in 2012. He has not giving any details. I was thinking of starting a thread on the official forum, but that forum is futile, if I start a thread there, it will be invaded by the whines of the PvP community.

I was just reading a thread on the possibility of 12 player dungeons and it was derail into a PvP topic and why AoC is such a failed game.

To get back to topic, I like to ask all of the people that have experience with crafting, professions and skills in other game to post here and comment on how they think the revamp should be. I hear that Star Wars Galaxies had a really good system and resulted in a good economy. Perhaps some of the elements of that game could be apply to the new system in AoC. I don’t know of any other game that was successful with the crafting system, but if you do, please post here and also post with your idea how you see it applied in AoC. Bear in mind that the current system will be reworked, but the current recipe and the time it took for the players that have those recipes must have some kind of reward.

If we get something good out of this thread, I will post it on the Test live and / or the live forum for feedback from Funcom.

Brothers of Arms New Crafting; Skill and profession system ideas for AoC.

• All potions, food and pots, should be only craftable and for sell from players. This would greatly promote the economy and the alchemist profession.
• Possible new profession, Cook.
• Runes and rune words to be added to armor.
• Gemcutters could gain the ability to add slot to weapons and armor.
• Alchemist could make blue kithai faction style potions. Perhaps, instead of buying potions from the faction sellers, you buy the recipe to make them.
• Add a random level of a stat when crafting an item. So when you craft a sword you can have different results and some better than others depending what level of crafting you are or what experience in crafting you got.
• Armorsmith could create consumable grinding stones of different type that would give the user the possibility of enhancing a weapon.
• Architect could have recipe to build resurrection pads.
• Weaponsmith and armorsmith of high level could buff up a team depending what decision they have taken during the levelling of the profession.
• Profession could have levels. Like PvP levels. The higher you are the better the recipes and the more luck you have for the special stats when you create an item.
• Guild city profession building would have special shops where armorsmith or weaponsmith could display their items and sell them. Players would have to go to that perticular building to access this player-vendor.
• Profession trading should start at level 10, in Tortage. This would promote the profession and crafting system.
  

[Magman]

My first idea is that all food and pots should only be craftable. You should only be able to get pots and food from quest rewards and from other players on the trader. All pots and food vendors should be removed and no food or pots should drop from killing mobs.

This would greatly enhance and promote the alchemist profession and perhaps even create a new profession, like cook. Right now the pots and food that an alchemist can do under level 80 is only made to finish the profession quest line. No one buys them cause a new one is available every 10 level and the ones you get from mobs are plenty to level up. A few should be available from quest reward in Tortage to show new players that they should use pots and food in combat, but after level 20, all food and pots should only be available from alchemists or cooks.

[lilieRose]

hum think you forgot that Crom is a PVE PVP and RP server server now.. some RP player try to survive with what they can drop and you forgot the FTP...i am using around a set of 100 pots in all raids i join..with 4/5 raids week you can check how many the cost is for me...and i craft for free i dont sell anything its a choice..i am offering many time the 1 gold welcome for the Horse/book to the news toon lvl40 .... i understand what you mean but you forgot that many players in Crom atm no have the same playing than you...if the npc seller pots go away in this game i know i will need to play 80% of my time in quest for the reward..and join perhaps 1/2 raid for 1/2 of my toons..
A better idea will be that only the alchimist workers can do some reallys uber nice potions fo all lvl, that nobody can find in shop or in Npc seller..
But with my playing i will probably offer it anw
Ps: i am open for try to explaim to you my world .. you re welcome
a other PS : with my playing i am not able to survive without donation , my Pom is descent cause the donation from phork, Damagedealer and Darmy.. and ava for his help for geared my hox..Thx to them

[Magman]

I understand Lily, but if pots and food are only available from other players, a lot of people are liek you, they give them away for free. I offer 4 hour food on every tier 3 raid.

Also, for pots, there is a real chance, I think a certanty, that if they were only available from other players, the price would be very low, most likely lower then the vendor price specialy at lower levels. (level 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 and 75) pots and food.

[Magman]

Another idea is runes. Like in Diablo 2. It could actually be exactly like Diablo 2, there could be runes words and this way many secret stats could be done. Runes could be applied to all armor. Even armor with no slots. It would simply add a few stat points. In the same way gems do, but maybe a little less. So it would not terribly change the balance, but still encourage people to go and get those runes. Runes words would be much bigger stat increase, not documented by Funcom so people would have to try things. Also, runes would not be able to be removed. So if you place a rune or a rune word, you can’t remove it, ever. If you put a run on your tier 3 chest, you better be sure. But if you want to change it, you simply have to get a new chest.

Anyways, I think runes and rune words in Diablo was a lot of fun and gave a lot of depth and new things to achieve to the game. It would be a great thing to include in the crafting system.

[lilieRose]

Yes idea about runes is nice.

i like too, that work in some others MMO, that when you craft a weapon or a armor piece you get the piece but with a bonus. that give a piece +1 or +2 or +3 lvl bonus, stil a normal piece but with a bonus in it. Stil + 25 critical rating or 150 damage, the bonus +3 give the best bonus. this bonus is % of luck but with a better % of luck if you re a hight lvl crafter in the appropriate work. So that motivate the crafter to up, to craft more, and they can try to craft the same piece many time for try to have the +3 bonus.

[Kyynelkeiju]

Biggest problem in crafting is not the crafting system itself but the overal toon leveling speed. Players are beyond the crafting rewards way faster than they are able to skill crafting or gather mats. Makes all below 80 crafting useless or at least not worth effort.

Second problem comes when ppl start to gear up with epics/khitai. There is only T2/T3-weapon crafting, nothing between blue 80 and epics. No recipe drops in Khitai (or good gear rewards in pre-rotgs). Nothing really that would serve ppl getting/using end-game gear. Makes crafting useless in end-game.

I wouldn't add more professions, but merely boost what there are now. F.e:

• Weaponsmiths could create consumables that give temporal augment to weapons (e.g. grinding stone).
• Armorsmisth could permanently enchant an armorpiece, or create upgrade packs.
• Jewelcrafters. All end-game gear and epics should be reviewed and slot(s) added. Or allow weaponsmiths/armormiths to drill the slot.
• Alchemists. Only profession that really don't need huge change. Maybe add khitai style 1h food buff recipe drops and blue quality potion recipe drops.
• Architects are little bit unknown to me. Buildable team/raid-wise rez pads?

To make crafting at low levels little bit more useful - add gathering trainers to Tortage, start gathering profession at lvl 5 and some nodes there as well. In current system players are level 30-50 before they even find PSW/LAcheish/Poitain, and then are wondering why areas where they level up does not have nodes or materials they need to skill profession. Maybe even make profession training easier (=require less mats) on those levels to reflect with class leveling speed.

Other option is to have profession trainers in main cities like OT/Khemi/Conarch - That is where they would popup exactly when players have level to learn them.

This forum is little bit wrong forum to QQ about this. But I'll guess you (Magman) will sum up best ideas and put them forward?

[Magman]

This forum is little bit wrong forum to QQ about this. But I'll guess you (Magman) will sum up best ideas and put them forward?

Yes, this is the idea, I will wait until we have more feedback from our guild and post them on test live or maybe the official forum. I am not looking for feedback from other players, I mean from none-guildies, if I posted this thread on the official forum, it would be about PvP now. I just want to sum-up ideas from us, BoA, and submit them to Funcom for their own after thoughts.

I have to say, you have some really good ideas, Kyynelkeiju, Weaponsmith augmenting weapons, any weapons like epics is a bit like the idea of runes and runes words but better. I am thinking about it now and I would go one step further and say that weaponsmith could specialise them self. You would have a training choice to do, a bit like now, but within a profession. So a Weaponsmith could be able to add critical rating to weapons and a different Weaponsmith could make a weapon with more or less hate rating for example.

Drilling holes for gems or runes would also be great.

You could also use weaponsmith or armorsmith as buffs. So if you have an armorsmith tier 10 in your group, everyone automatically gets more protection or armor. Again, you would have to make a choice when levelling Armorsmith, do you go for a better physical armorsmith, that would add a armor buff to the group or do you go for a magical armorsmith, that would add protection to the group.

I am sure that end-game players would run to become a specialised profession to gain those buffs. Many would go for buffs that gives more DPS, but the rare ones that goes for damage mitigation or other things like that would also be sought after by raid leaders.

Thanks Kyy, I added your ideas to the list.

[Magman]

The issue of the viability of profession at low level is also something that should be addressed.
This is a pretty hard one. Like Kyy said, people level so fast that it’s a bit useless to have a weapon that gives a bit more damage when there is one that drops in 3 or 4 levels that is much better.

Personal buffs and group buffs from profession would definitely be an incentive during levelling.
Starting profession a lot earlier would also be good. Like Kyy said, starting in Tortage. This would show new players that professions are an important part of the game.

Another idea would be to have guild vendors. If you are a armorsmith, you can place things you made for sale at your own guild armorsmith building. The adventage of this would be that the item would not take any space in your inventory, but in the inventory of the guild armorsmith. Only armorsmith of certain levels would be able to. Perhaps higher level armorsmith you are more slots you have available at the guild armorsmith vendor. Outsiders, non-guildies, could also buy there, but they would have to come to the guild city. This could add a social inter-guild aspect to the professions.

[Theofric]

I would encourage if it were possible to stress the fact that the recipe acquisition system to me seems to be very bad right now, if the recipe systems remains in place that is.

I find it very strange you have to farm only 2 locations for the most important Alchemy recipes, Atzel Smith and Cistern. They should be moved to Khitai perhaps? At least a few of them so it wouldn't feel like you're doing some chore for which people are hard to get and even if you get guildies to show up, they're only there to help you get a recipe so you can craft stuff for them in future, I don't find the whole thing fun. And farming the last boss in Cistern with 80s for example to get the recipes I find it... out of place.

I mean you only realize how the whole tradeskill system with cultural/city etc gear works long after you leveled you first 80, if you started playing in the last 1-1.5 years (like I did) and weren't around for the gradual build up of the tradeskill system.

[Magman]

I agree with you Theofric, but I don't see how else they can make the recipe system so it stays rare. If for example you could get recipe from a merchant, everyone would haqve them and this would make the market for the item crafter completely useless.

An other way, perhaps, would be to get, for example, culture recipe, you have to join that culture and raise in level jusat like a Khitai faction. Then, when you have reach the top you can craft culture items of that culture. You would also be limited to only one culture. Otherwise people would simply level all cultures.

For alchemist, I can only see a mush harder and longer process to become alchemist and as you level you get new recipes. But it would have to be very long, like a Khitai faction, again. Otherwise everyone would have all those recipes.

If you got all recipes part of the training, I would even say that a character can only be one profession, not two.
Again, I like to know how they did it in other games where the crafting is considered very good. For example in Star Wars Galaxies, how did one get to craft a rare item?

all food for thoughts...

[Magman]

Thread posted on Test Live

http://forums-tl.ageofconan.com/showthr ... post556440

[Gert]

With the tradeskills we are completely re-vamping that system. Top to bottom. We didn’t think it would be efficient to just try and band aid the current system. Once we had accepted that the existing system just wasn’t interesting enough, we committed to giving it a more complete and thorough overhaul. That allows us to hopefully come out the other end with something deep and engaging. We wanted to aim for something closer to some of the older classic implementations of trade-skills rather than the ‘just click for item’ style of more recent games. The inspirations were games like Star Wars Galaxies, Diablo, and the like and then try to blend in some modern touches.

Little hint to the changes coming...

[Magman]

Yes, that sounds really good actually. It's kind of cool that they are looking at Diablo. I don't know nothing about the system in SWG, but apparently it was good.
In Diablo, a few of the good things were the random attributes you could get. So for example, you made a sword and you good be lucky and get an epic one. With the same recipe and same matts someone else would get different stats. Not so different, so one would get +250 combat rating and other would be +255 Combat Rating. It was really fun. There was also the rune words. So an item with 3 gem slots, you could put gems or runes. If you put runes in certain sequence, you made a rune word that gave extra starts to the item. The last thing I liked is the complete set bonus. So if you had the complete Tiger set from Khitai you get an extra bonus if you equipped all 7 pieces.

Anyways, I can't wait to see what they will do. I hope they will release hints about it soon. I guess it will not be until late summer that we will have it. The other things is how they going to compensate for people that got the old recipes?

[ivga]

i like the weapons and armor system in guildwars very much.

gear is the same for everyone, cheap and expensive gear has the same stats.
No lfg must be geared there.

its possible to get along with the weapons that drop, and if you want something special, you can either buy it or go farm for it.
you can salvage good parts of a bad weapon and put it on another weapon thats more of you likings.

what i also dislike myself is the bind on system in aoc.
For armor its fine with me, but for weapons i find it a big nono.

just my 2 cents 8)

[Magman]

According to the last interview, the new crafting is based on Star Wars Galaxies and Diablo!

If they had randomness and rune words like in Diablo, I will be very happy.